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Animal Shelter Advisory Committee Minutes - 01/08/2008r MINUTES OF THE MEETING FOR THE ANIMAL SHELTER ADVISORY COMMITTEE (ASAC) OF JANUARY 8, 2008 PLACE: Wichita Falls- Wichita County Public Health District, Parker Conference Room, 1700 Third Street, Wichita Falls, Texas, 76301. TIME: 12:15 p.m. DATE: Thursday, November 8, 2007. COMMITTEE MEMBERS PRESENT: Julie Gibson, DVM; Marty Maxwell, Animal Welfare Organization Representative; Rick Wright, Animal Reclaim Center Operator; and Susan Morris, R.S., Chairman /LRCA/Zoonosis Administrator. COMMITTEE MEMBERS ABSENT: Penny Miller, Citizen -At -Large HEALTH DISTRICT REPRESENTATIVES: Amy Cone, Assistant Director of Public Health; Susan Morris, R.S., Chairman /LRCA /Zoonosis Administrator, and Diane Syrus, recording secretary. WICHITA FALLS -CITY COUNCIL: Michael Smith, Councilor- District 1, and Charles Elmore, Councilor- District 5. MINUTES: I. Call to order: Susan Morris, R.S., Chairman presided. She welcomed Amy Cone, Assistant Director of Public Health, and Councilor from District 5, Charles Elmore. Susan asked everyone to introduce themselves. II. Approval of Minutes: The minutes from the ASAC Meeting on November 8, 2007, were distributed and reviewed. Mr. Smith noted that he was absent at the last meeting and could not have made the statement in Item 6. Discussion followed that this motion was made by Mr. Wright. Mrs. Maxwell made the motion to accept these corrected minutes, with a second by Mr. Wright. Motion carried. III. Old Business: None. IV. New Business: Mrs. Morris stated the primarily reason for this meeting is to discuss monkeys, primates under 15 pounds. She wanted to verify that everyone understood our role as advisory chairman to the Council and thus, distributed a copy of the committee's role. Mrs. Morris explained Sec. 14 -324. "Duties" (Exhibit A). She asked the committee two Questions; 1) If we allow citizens in Wichita Falls to have wild animals under 15 pounds, as pets, and if they become loose, or they are no longer wanted and are impounded; can the shelter handle that; and if we allow citizens in Wichita Falls to have primates under 15 pounds, as pets, and that pet becomes loose, or they no longer want them and are impounded; can the shelter handle that. Susan said that Question #1 models another city ordinance that Mr. Elmore is looking at, but it lowers the weight. Discussion followed. Mrs. Morris asked to go back to our first question; if we worded an ordinance with regulated animals those being wild by nature or disposition which requires these animals to be reclaimed, retrained and maintained by art, in other words, you have to be trained to maintained them or to keep them under control. Mrs. Morris asked Mr. Wright and Dr. Gibson, specifically, if we were to pass an ordinance that allows those animals; do we have the facilities, manpower, and training to handle those animals if they were brought into our shelter? Mr. Wright and Dr. Gibson both answered no. Mrs. Morris announced that Rick brought a letter from Kelli Jordan, Exec. Director of the Humane Society, just before this meeting (Exhibit B), which has been unread up to this point. Mr. Smith asked Mr. Wright if a Capuchin monkey came in today, what the shelter would do. Mr. Wright answered that the humane society does not really have any place to put a monkey; all dog kennels and cages open at the top. The shelter does have small stainless cages (about 2' x 2') that the monkeys could go in, but it would be inhumane treatment to place a monkey that is used to climbing and jumping in a little pen for 3 days to wait to be reclaimed, which is required by law before we could dispose of it. Mr. Wright said that monkeys could not be adopted out but disposed of because the liability is too high. Mr. Smith asked if anyone has had contact with Rescue Centers in the state or nation. Mrs. Maxwell answered yes, that her Executive Director, Bob Lindsey, of Wild Bird Rescue came from San Antonio's Wildlife Rescue where they had a primate section and he has a lot of horror stories to tell. Marty welcomed Mr. Smith to talk to him to gain more information. Mr. Wright explained that rescues can be problematic because some pets are not adaptable, a family is willing but does not have room, and then the shelter becomes a boarding facility. Mrs. Morris called all the veterinarian clinics in town and asked if they treated or could handle monkeys, and every vet said no. Thus, if an injured monkey would need medical care; we do not have a vet that could treat it. Dr. Gibson explained monkeys carry many communicable diseases and vets do not want the risk. Discussion followed. Mrs. Maxwell said once monkeys bond with a family, if that family can't handle them, (because monkeys act like a child for 40 -60 years) and take it to zoo or reserve where they don't bond with the other primates or acclimate to a new family. Mrs. Maxwell told a story about a primate with deep depression that if the former family did not take it back; it was going to be euthanized. She said monkeys have the behavior of a child, and it is like abandoning a child but when they reach puberty, monkeys become totally different animals, and sometimes they bite fingers & thumbs off because of anger of not having a mate. Zoos usually don't accept unwanted monkeys. Discussion followed Mrs. Morris asked the committee their conclusion regarding wild animals under 15 pounds? Mr. Wright said that if we open it up to one animal, then we open it up to more. She asked about the primate issue. Mr. Smith said that Mr. Elmore has had contact with one person, and Mr. Smith has had one call but could not get that person to call him back, but he asked Mr. Elmore about his conversation? Mr. Elmore explained these critters are already here; he would like to know where they are and do some type of control of these animals; he is not requesting a wild animal ordinance but simply a stipulation regarding nonhuman primates under 15 pounds. Discussion followed Susan said she went into a website and asked, "I want to buy a monkey, what do I do ?" The first and most frequent response was to verify state and local /city laws to see if allowed. The second response was that monkeys are not for everyone, they are difficult, and it lists pages and pages of why you should not get a monkey, and these are from owners. Thus, Mrs. Morris is a little hesitant to pass a law to retrofit a violation of the law, and then encourage more monkey ownership. Discussion followed Mrs. Morris stated that she received another letter this morning (Exhibit C), which is also unread, from Janice Sowers, President of the Board of the Humane Society of Wichita County, which was distributed. The last sentence of this letter states the Humane Society does not agree with an ordinance that allows wild animals to be kept as pets within Wichita Falls or anywhere else. Mr. Smith asked if any coyotes are being kept in Wichita Falls. Mr. Elmore knew of hybrid wolves. Susan said that those are explicitly not allowed in our ordinance. Mrs. Morris explained that without DNA testing which is expensive, it is hard to determine, and we cannot afford this loosing battle. She asked citizens with unregulated animals, to remove from the city limits. Discussion followed on lamas, buffalos (livestock), ostriches, and can usually be placed in some category, even though they are not fowl; we still have to place them in that fowl category, but what do you do with a monkey? Discussion followed. Ms. Cone justified this as the reason we went with the regulated animal category; to leave the definition broad and less vague, so that if a citizen called, the council or mayor could explain. Ms. Cone said we have more of a chance to regulate. Mrs. Morris proposed, if we wanted to continue with this, there are specific requirements to keep regulated animals, not just monkeys, like caging requirements and micro - chipping. Mr. Elmore stated that he would be in favor of micro - chipping all pets. Ms. Cone stated the question in reference to monkeys would be that no vet will handle monkeys. Our shelter typically does dogs; but who would perform identification of these other animals that are more foreign and not typical. Ms. Cone explained this is another reason that we left the ordinance broad and not vague for instances when we receive phone calls and not have to modify the ordinance. Mr. Elmore asked if we have what is suggested. Mrs. Morris said yes and a copy has been distributed to each here (Exhibit D). These pages with changes only, because our ordinance is 26 -28 pages long and these changes are highlighted for convenience. Mrs. Maxwell cited that primates carry human diseases where other domestic animals do not. Mrs. Morris said the most common diseases that primates carry are herpes simplex, which is a zoonotic disease that can be transmitted from species to species; Monkeys catch human diseases more readily than anything else, like the flu. Dr. Gibson said yes, also TB and hepatitis, and HIV. Mrs. Morris said even though the chances of a monkey being born and raised in U.S. having HIV is going to be slim, monkeys can readily transmit hepatitis, herpes, and everyday illnesses that make us sick, and it can go back and forth as interspecies changing, because they are closely related to humans. Mrs. Morris stated that she loves animals, and if she thought a monkey would be a good pet; she would highly recommend it. She advised what only she can state as a regulator; when someone is told to get rid of an animal or to take it outside of the city limits, we don't seize that animal unless it is declared a real danger and has hurt someone, or if the animal is being mistreated; but concerning this lady being scared of the "monkey police "; that is not the way we operate here at the Health District. We ask people to remove animals from the city limits. Mr. Wright said also monkeys transmit human diseases so readily, he thinks that it places Health District employees and the Human Society personnel at a higher risk when possibly dealing with these animals since we have contractual obligation to take them, unless our contract is changed. Mrs. Morris said that there is currently a law that passed the Senate, but failed the House, that would outlaw transportation across state lines, called the "Lacy Act "; it states that you cannot take animals such as cougars, lions, tiger across state lines for the purpose of commerce, but you can take across for a circus or as a trainer. This law is currently being voted on, and it has a lot of support that will not allow these animals to be transported, so they are stuck here in Texas, unless a zoo or a rescue center takes them. She said it is also illegal to bring these animals in the U.S., for purpose of selling them. Mr. Elmore said that he will report to this citizen that the big concern is not her monkey, but it is the next monkey, that its owner may not have the capabilities or a local veterinarian to properly care for it. Mr. Elmore further stated that next Tuesday; if this is on the Council Agenda, he would like to explore the options. Ms. Cone agreed that both sides will be explored. Mr. Elmore said that he is complete accord with page 26, page 28; but would like to read it several times. Mr. Morris asked if she can add one caveat because the city has this 28 -page ordinance that requires licensing of animals, permits for hobby breeders for possession over 4 animals, livestock permits, etc.; and we have good citizens that comply, but the majority of the citizens in Wichita Falls do not have their animals licensed even though we have a state law requiring all animals over 4 months of age to have rabies shots. She said we have all these laws in place and we can enforce them until we find somebody breaking the law and that is what we do. She said that this will be a voluntarily compliance now, and you already know of three citizens that are not complying. Mrs. Morris repeated that Animal Control cannot go door to door to enforce this, but we have the law and it is good tool to use, but the next ticket we write, somebody is going to get mad. Mrs. Morris said she does not know what the complete answer is. Mr. Smith asked Ms. Cone if Mrs. Franklin desires a decision from this group, and the Board of Health also, before she reports to the Council. Ms. Cone answered yes; the request originally came in from a request from Councilor Elmore to explore this issue, so we did it both ways, and Mrs. Franklin wanted assistance from both the A.S.A.C. and the Board of Health. Mrs. Morris asked for a recommendation, one way or another? Mr. Wright recommended that we leave the ordinance as is. Dr. Gibson second. Mrs. Morris asked if there was any further discussion or do we want to go ahead. Dr. Gibson said that she wanted to add this to the discussion that she agrees with Mr. Wright about having the ordinance stay as stated, but this keeps it in with check. Mr. Elmore said that he appreciates her comment and this tells him a lot. Dr. Gibson said that because if citizens do follow the City's rules and regulation which this lady is probably already not doing, then if they are following the rules and regulations, they're not going to do it and there would not be any rules and regulations in this town to fall back on unless a veterinarian is risking his license. Susan asked all in favor; all ayed, and no opposition was raised. She thanked everyone for spending over an hour on this meeting and for everyone's work. V. Adjournment: Mrs. Morris asked for the meeting to be adjourned. The meeting was adjourned at 1:20 p.m. Respectfully Submitted, Susan B. Morris, R.S., Chairman Zoonosis Administrator /L.R.C.A. tl Diane Syrus Zoonosis & OSSF, Sr. Admin. Clerk